nozerd
05-11 09:12 AM
Folks,
I just got back from Canada yesterday. I am a PR holder landed in 2005. I had gone for my 8-11 yrs H1 stamping. Needless to say this trip I was very vigilant and observant about Toronto. Here are some thoughts.
1) When you enter Canada they will ask you to fill a customs/immigration form. On the form one question that is asked is " When were you last in Canada" also the form asks for your "current permanant address". So in my case I was last in Canada in May 2005 and I entered last week it aroused suspision. The officer asked me if I was within 2 to 5 yr room. I told him I was and I was using this trip to plan for our move. So after some questioning he let me in. I guess if that date was March 2007 instead of 2005 he may not have questioned me as much.
2) As far as lifestyle and products there is no products not available there. Every food item and consumer good is available in Canada. The grocery stores and their shelves look the same. Since the population is low most iotems are made in US and imported. Only way to know its a Canadian market is because by law all products need to be marked in English and French.
3) Malls etc are the same as US. Eaton Center or Vaughn Mills is no different then The Galleria or Katy Mills in Houston.
4) Housing is what you pay for it. It is definitely more expensive than Texas and Southern US but cheaper than California or NY. Rents are cheaper in run down areas and expensive in good areas ( duh !). In a major commercial area in a middle class building I was quoted $ 1000 for a bachelor and $ 1,200 for a 1 bedroom apt but this was all bills paid.
5) Jobs are fewer than US. Best thing to do is take a transfer with your company if they have offices there ( I know of 4 ppl who have done that). Basically if you have a US, Canadian or UK education you will be fine but iof your education is purely from India you may have a tougher time. A good option is to find a job in a border city and commute daily ( Windsor/Detroit or Foret Erie/Buffalo). I think this is a very good option if you can get a job in Detroit or Buffalo.
6) Taxes are high. I was told by many that whatever taxes you pay in US double them. Sales tax is 15% in ON where it is 8% in TX. Income tax is also higher. Higher taxes are a fact of life in Canada (no ifs ands or buts). In return you have a country where there is no fiscal or budgetary deficit and a very well funded social security system ( unlike US). You also have benefits like 9 months paid maternity leave, a pmt every month for every child you have and medical benefits.
7) Awesome public transport system. Gas is $ 1.04 or so a litrer when I was there. Insurance is expensivbe but not topo bad if you have a US license and good solid 5 yr US driving record. However its ridiculously high for non US or European immigrants.
So bottom line Canada is not US and comparing it to US is not fair. However its the closesnt to the US you will get in any other country. Its everyones personal decision and no one forces anyone to apply or mopve there. One could always takje a vacation/leave of absense and go try for a job there. Or else work in detroit/buffalo. Now detroit/buffalo is in US can you find job there ??????? or are they doomed too because of proximity to Canada:rolleyes:
I just got back from Canada yesterday. I am a PR holder landed in 2005. I had gone for my 8-11 yrs H1 stamping. Needless to say this trip I was very vigilant and observant about Toronto. Here are some thoughts.
1) When you enter Canada they will ask you to fill a customs/immigration form. On the form one question that is asked is " When were you last in Canada" also the form asks for your "current permanant address". So in my case I was last in Canada in May 2005 and I entered last week it aroused suspision. The officer asked me if I was within 2 to 5 yr room. I told him I was and I was using this trip to plan for our move. So after some questioning he let me in. I guess if that date was March 2007 instead of 2005 he may not have questioned me as much.
2) As far as lifestyle and products there is no products not available there. Every food item and consumer good is available in Canada. The grocery stores and their shelves look the same. Since the population is low most iotems are made in US and imported. Only way to know its a Canadian market is because by law all products need to be marked in English and French.
3) Malls etc are the same as US. Eaton Center or Vaughn Mills is no different then The Galleria or Katy Mills in Houston.
4) Housing is what you pay for it. It is definitely more expensive than Texas and Southern US but cheaper than California or NY. Rents are cheaper in run down areas and expensive in good areas ( duh !). In a major commercial area in a middle class building I was quoted $ 1000 for a bachelor and $ 1,200 for a 1 bedroom apt but this was all bills paid.
5) Jobs are fewer than US. Best thing to do is take a transfer with your company if they have offices there ( I know of 4 ppl who have done that). Basically if you have a US, Canadian or UK education you will be fine but iof your education is purely from India you may have a tougher time. A good option is to find a job in a border city and commute daily ( Windsor/Detroit or Foret Erie/Buffalo). I think this is a very good option if you can get a job in Detroit or Buffalo.
6) Taxes are high. I was told by many that whatever taxes you pay in US double them. Sales tax is 15% in ON where it is 8% in TX. Income tax is also higher. Higher taxes are a fact of life in Canada (no ifs ands or buts). In return you have a country where there is no fiscal or budgetary deficit and a very well funded social security system ( unlike US). You also have benefits like 9 months paid maternity leave, a pmt every month for every child you have and medical benefits.
7) Awesome public transport system. Gas is $ 1.04 or so a litrer when I was there. Insurance is expensivbe but not topo bad if you have a US license and good solid 5 yr US driving record. However its ridiculously high for non US or European immigrants.
So bottom line Canada is not US and comparing it to US is not fair. However its the closesnt to the US you will get in any other country. Its everyones personal decision and no one forces anyone to apply or mopve there. One could always takje a vacation/leave of absense and go try for a job there. Or else work in detroit/buffalo. Now detroit/buffalo is in US can you find job there ??????? or are they doomed too because of proximity to Canada:rolleyes:
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gimmeacard
07-28 10:45 PM
Wait a min , how much had you?? Your status is Member and Kaushal's is a Donor.. wait a min let me think who is donating and who is a FREELOADER here.
The guy is doing something to make his life better, atleast making an attempt to do something better, why do you losers are trying to demotivate and shoot him down.
No work is small or big , good or bad , work is work.. you wanna do it , just do it , else walk to out. Do not exhibit the desi attitude "I won't do it as what someone will say and also do not let any one else do it." Grow up.
OOPS a bitter and exhausted Amwayiter has arrived
The guy is doing something to make his life better, atleast making an attempt to do something better, why do you losers are trying to demotivate and shoot him down.
No work is small or big , good or bad , work is work.. you wanna do it , just do it , else walk to out. Do not exhibit the desi attitude "I won't do it as what someone will say and also do not let any one else do it." Grow up.
OOPS a bitter and exhausted Amwayiter has arrived
soljabhai
12-14 05:34 PM
100$
2011 Larry Crowne, in London.
hiralal
06-04 07:00 AM
An easier fix would be to accord a FINAL status for a pre-adjudicated application. USCIS should not/cannot issue an RFE on an application once it has been accorded a FINAL status. The new status FINAL should be visible online and a formal document should be issued to the applicant stating that the application has been accorded a FINAL status.
This is easier to get done rather than an iterim GC. Applicant gets the peace of mind and can go around buying houses, changing jobs etc whereas it is just a procedural change for USCIS.
I agree ...giving a FINAL status would help everyone ..even USCIS ..as once they process the case, they don't have to look at it again.
and they can deport those who have broken the laws sooner ..can we have a campaign on this ? let us start with something small atleast ...
I wonder why the USCIS director did not mention this during congress hearings ..I guess no one cares about immigrants :)
---------------------
ALSO I wonder why AILA and Murthy don't come up with such ideas when they meet Charles Openhiem ???? obvious answer is that it does not help AILA in anyway ?
--------------------
This is easier to get done rather than an iterim GC. Applicant gets the peace of mind and can go around buying houses, changing jobs etc whereas it is just a procedural change for USCIS.
I agree ...giving a FINAL status would help everyone ..even USCIS ..as once they process the case, they don't have to look at it again.
and they can deport those who have broken the laws sooner ..can we have a campaign on this ? let us start with something small atleast ...
I wonder why the USCIS director did not mention this during congress hearings ..I guess no one cares about immigrants :)
---------------------
ALSO I wonder why AILA and Murthy don't come up with such ideas when they meet Charles Openhiem ???? obvious answer is that it does not help AILA in anyway ?
--------------------
more...
krishmunn
06-12 12:20 PM
I wonder what Dilip was doing when he was laid off. An H1 holder is out of status the moment he/she is laid off. So, our brightest Dilip was out of status (aka illegal) during the period he was laid off.
As is said -- illegals have a better chance to get GC then those trying to be legal.
With such friends of prospecting immigrants you sure do not need an anti-immigrant.
As is said -- illegals have a better chance to get GC then those trying to be legal.
With such friends of prospecting immigrants you sure do not need an anti-immigrant.
tikka
07-04 09:43 AM
please continue Digging
http://digg.com/politics/USCIS_Visa_scandal
http://digg.com/politics/Rep_Lofgren_Issues_Statement_on_Updated_Visa_Bulle tin
http://digg.com/politics/U_S_Withdraws_Offer_of_60_000_Job_Based_Visas_Ange ring_Immigration_Lawyer/who
thank you
http://digg.com/politics/USCIS_Visa_scandal
http://digg.com/politics/Rep_Lofgren_Issues_Statement_on_Updated_Visa_Bulle tin
http://digg.com/politics/U_S_Withdraws_Offer_of_60_000_Job_Based_Visas_Ange ring_Immigration_Lawyer/who
thank you
more...
sertasheep
07-04 12:47 PM
amitjoey, janakp, tikka, macaca, others, please check your email or Private messages for a proposed conf call for some of the key members from IV
2010 #39;Larry Crowne#39; LA Premiere
illusions
05-18 02:09 PM
Well,
Panini's profile is "WRONG" on this thread too: http://immigrationvoice.org/forum/showpost.php?p=237356&postcount=1
More, It is wrong to put fake data. All I suggested is that it has some impact on his credibility and his reaction was very strong. I agree with his post contents and second them too! Not comfortable with someone roaming around with fake profile - keep in mind profile is the same whether it is immigration or non-immigration related thread.
You tell me the reason you think why Panini put wrong profile data. OK, you don't know, then tell me why you put correct profile information? You will get your answer.
Marphad, i didn't say that it's wrong or right, you implied he is anti immigrant, spreading rumors and writing un-necessary posts, i just failed to see how you concluded all that just by looking at his profile ? And point taken after you replied.
And isn't the content in his profile all default content (correct me if i'm wrong) when the tracker was introduced, even i had a changeability as US. And i'm not trying to defend him, but you seem to assume it's fake. And the way i see it, it is incomplete.
If one has a fake profile do you really think he will make it so obvious ? it would resemble more accurate data than the most obvious.
And i do know the profile carries on to a on-related immi thread, no doubts there, except it only makes sense looking and analyzing it when related to an immi issue, unless you are looking for something else.
Panini's profile is "WRONG" on this thread too: http://immigrationvoice.org/forum/showpost.php?p=237356&postcount=1
More, It is wrong to put fake data. All I suggested is that it has some impact on his credibility and his reaction was very strong. I agree with his post contents and second them too! Not comfortable with someone roaming around with fake profile - keep in mind profile is the same whether it is immigration or non-immigration related thread.
You tell me the reason you think why Panini put wrong profile data. OK, you don't know, then tell me why you put correct profile information? You will get your answer.
Marphad, i didn't say that it's wrong or right, you implied he is anti immigrant, spreading rumors and writing un-necessary posts, i just failed to see how you concluded all that just by looking at his profile ? And point taken after you replied.
And isn't the content in his profile all default content (correct me if i'm wrong) when the tracker was introduced, even i had a changeability as US. And i'm not trying to defend him, but you seem to assume it's fake. And the way i see it, it is incomplete.
If one has a fake profile do you really think he will make it so obvious ? it would resemble more accurate data than the most obvious.
And i do know the profile carries on to a on-related immi thread, no doubts there, except it only makes sense looking and analyzing it when related to an immi issue, unless you are looking for something else.
more...
newtoearth
05-02 04:34 PM
...
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yetanotherguyinline
09-04 07:59 PM
yetanotherguyinline,
You may not care, but many members do care about what's happening in India.
I deeply care about what is happening in my motherland. But this is not the right forum to discuss these issues. Immigration voice is a organization that represents skilled immigrants seeking to emigrate to US and I believe the type of conversation in this thread is not representative of legal immigrant's views (including the majority from India). What we post on open forum is available to everyone and can be used against us in future for propaganda purposes.
I will probably not respond to future posts but I request admins to consider closing and deleting this thread.
You may not care, but many members do care about what's happening in India.
I deeply care about what is happening in my motherland. But this is not the right forum to discuss these issues. Immigration voice is a organization that represents skilled immigrants seeking to emigrate to US and I believe the type of conversation in this thread is not representative of legal immigrant's views (including the majority from India). What we post on open forum is available to everyone and can be used against us in future for propaganda purposes.
I will probably not respond to future posts but I request admins to consider closing and deleting this thread.
more...
new2gc
09-04 01:53 PM
You dont even talk about my village even in your dreams.. Our village is much happier than before 5 years.. Its all becuase of YSR did for our village.
Looks like Your village might not have any resources to loot, so has shown some work which would have benefited few people (Like you).
As some other member mentioned that Jesus is angry on him, Not only Jesus, even Lord Venkateswara was also angry because even after converting to Christan, he took all the honors that chief of the state would get at Tirumala. Also, one can clearly see in Tirumala the way the whole administration behave during YSR regime compared to NTR/NCB regime. One can only experience, cannot explain..it will lengthy story...
His polices like, Govt money for Vatican trips and causing lot of grievence to the devotees in Tirumala should also be considered to evaluate his attitude, don't just go with TV news.
When Chiru campaigned for PPP, there were millions of people attended his meetings, but we all know what the result was.
So, just think like 1 corrupt politician down many left and move on. No more arguments.
Looks like Your village might not have any resources to loot, so has shown some work which would have benefited few people (Like you).
As some other member mentioned that Jesus is angry on him, Not only Jesus, even Lord Venkateswara was also angry because even after converting to Christan, he took all the honors that chief of the state would get at Tirumala. Also, one can clearly see in Tirumala the way the whole administration behave during YSR regime compared to NTR/NCB regime. One can only experience, cannot explain..it will lengthy story...
His polices like, Govt money for Vatican trips and causing lot of grievence to the devotees in Tirumala should also be considered to evaluate his attitude, don't just go with TV news.
When Chiru campaigned for PPP, there were millions of people attended his meetings, but we all know what the result was.
So, just think like 1 corrupt politician down many left and move on. No more arguments.
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OLDMONK
07-24 04:29 PM
Its not the question of economy alone. When deciding to go back. Its a question about convenience.
a) I don't want to stand in line to pay my Electric/Telephone/House Tax/Income Tax/Train Ticket/Air Ticket/Bus Ticket/Children Admission-donations/Petrol Line/LP Gas Line/Restaurant Line/Chola Bhatura Line/Samosa Line/RTO Office line/Registration line/License Line/Stock Buy line/Stock Sell Line/Bank Deposit Line/Bank Draft Line/Fixed Deposit Line/Kisaan Vikas Patra Line/Registered/Speed post Line/Blue Dart Line/Company registration line/College admission line/College fee line/University degree line/Interview Line/Booking a Car line/Beer Whisky Line/Canteen Line.
Half the country stands in line, the other half manages the line. Neither has any civic sense.
b) I don't want to bribe babus who manage above lines to get ahead in line.
d) I don't want power failures/cooler failures/ac failures/broken roads/or other catastrophic system failures.
e) I dont want fake or mixed eating oil / flour / milk / cheese / butter / peppers / lentils / rice
f) I don't want dangerous chemical fertilizers in my produce (slow killers - massive kidney failure rate in India for past 10 years)
g) I don't want to teach my children dishonesty and tricks of survival/street smartness (in ref to corruption in India) which don't add any value to their personality.
h) The only reason I would wanna go back is for my immediate family and friends. Thats the only thing I miss when it comes to India.
I wouldn't go back and I believe even MK Gandhi himself would'nt leave from Africa for India in todays times.
Also Its the enemy within (corruption) which can cause great harm and we have that kind of enemy now. You can never ever change the attitudes which people carry in India without another revolution.
I am sure I can come up with a huge list of positives too, They will sound very good and will give me a great feeling of fake National Pride.
Now go ahead and kill me for saying all the above.!!
a) I don't want to stand in line to pay my Electric/Telephone/House Tax/Income Tax/Train Ticket/Air Ticket/Bus Ticket/Children Admission-donations/Petrol Line/LP Gas Line/Restaurant Line/Chola Bhatura Line/Samosa Line/RTO Office line/Registration line/License Line/Stock Buy line/Stock Sell Line/Bank Deposit Line/Bank Draft Line/Fixed Deposit Line/Kisaan Vikas Patra Line/Registered/Speed post Line/Blue Dart Line/Company registration line/College admission line/College fee line/University degree line/Interview Line/Booking a Car line/Beer Whisky Line/Canteen Line.
Half the country stands in line, the other half manages the line. Neither has any civic sense.
b) I don't want to bribe babus who manage above lines to get ahead in line.
d) I don't want power failures/cooler failures/ac failures/broken roads/or other catastrophic system failures.
e) I dont want fake or mixed eating oil / flour / milk / cheese / butter / peppers / lentils / rice
f) I don't want dangerous chemical fertilizers in my produce (slow killers - massive kidney failure rate in India for past 10 years)
g) I don't want to teach my children dishonesty and tricks of survival/street smartness (in ref to corruption in India) which don't add any value to their personality.
h) The only reason I would wanna go back is for my immediate family and friends. Thats the only thing I miss when it comes to India.
I wouldn't go back and I believe even MK Gandhi himself would'nt leave from Africa for India in todays times.
Also Its the enemy within (corruption) which can cause great harm and we have that kind of enemy now. You can never ever change the attitudes which people carry in India without another revolution.
I am sure I can come up with a huge list of positives too, They will sound very good and will give me a great feeling of fake National Pride.
Now go ahead and kill me for saying all the above.!!
more...
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admin
12-31 07:22 PM
Very good find logiclife. Hope we can get such good points across to our legislators.
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alisa
06-28 08:44 PM
If USCIS do reject application without notice then we should file a big law suite...AILA will be with us..
Sure!!!
Nothing will come out of it.
Whats the difference between God and USCIS?
Atleast God doesn't think that He is USCIS.
So, relax.
In the worst case scenario, we will be no better off in July than we are in June.
Sure!!!
Nothing will come out of it.
Whats the difference between God and USCIS?
Atleast God doesn't think that He is USCIS.
So, relax.
In the worst case scenario, we will be no better off in July than we are in June.
more...
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sankap
07-12 11:14 AM
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/27/washington/27points.html?ex=1184385600&en=d3301beecf778d15&ei=5070
June 27, 2007
Canada�s Policy on Immigrants Brings Backlog
By CHRISTOPHER MASON and JULIA PRESTON
TORONTO, June 26 � With an advanced degree in business management from a university in India and impeccable English, Salman Kureishy is precisely the type of foreigner that Canada�s merit-based immigration system was designed to attract.
Yet eight years went by from the time Mr. Kureishy passed his first Canadian immigration test until he moved from India to Canada. Then he had to endure nine months of bureaucratic delays before landing a job in his field in March.
Mr. Kureishy�s experience � and that of Canada�s immigration system � offers a cautionary tale for the United States. Mr. Kureishy came to this country under a system Canada pioneered in the 1960s that favors highly skilled foreigners, by assigning points for education and work experience and accepting those who earn high scores.
A similar point system for the United States is proposed in the immigration bill that bounced back to life on Tuesday, when the Senate reversed a previous stand and brought the bill back to the floor. The vote did not guarantee passage of the bill, which calls for the biggest changes in immigration law in more than 20 years.
The point system has helped Canada compete with the United States and other Western powers for highly educated workers, the most coveted immigrants in high-tech and other cutting-edge industries. But in recent years, immigration lawyers and labor market analysts say, the Canadian system has become an immovable beast, with a backlog of more than 800,000 applications and waits of four years or more.
The system�s bias toward the educated has left some industries crying out for skilled blue-collar workers, especially in western Canada where Alberta�s busy oil fields have generated an economic boom. Studies by the Alberta government show the province could be short by as many as 100,000 workers over the next decade.
In response, some Canadian employers are sidestepping the point system and relying instead on a program initiated in 1998 that allows provincial governments to hand-pick some immigrant workers, and on temporary foreign-worker permits.
�The points system is so inflexible,� said Herman Van Reekum, an immigration consultant in Calgary who helps Alberta employers find workers. �We need low-skill workers and trades workers here, and those people have no hope under the points system.�
Canada accepts about 250,000 immigrants each year, more than doubling the per-capita rate of immigration in the United States, census figures from both countries show. Nearly two-thirds of Canada�s population growth comes from immigrants, according to the 2006 census, compared with the United States, where about 43 percent of the population growth comes from immigration. Approximately half of Canada�s immigrants come through the point system.
Under Canada�s system, 67 points on a 100-point test is a passing score. In addition to education and work experience, aspiring immigrants earn high points for their command of languages and for being between 21 and 49 years old. In the United States, the Senate bill would grant higher points for advanced education, English proficiency and skills in technology and other fields that are in demand. Lower points would be given for the family ties that have been the basic stepping stones of the American immigration system for four decades.
Part of the backlog in Canada can be traced to a provision in the Canadian system that allows highly skilled foreigners to apply to immigrate even if they do not have a job offer. Similarly, the Senate bill would not require merit system applicants to have job offers in the United States, although it would grant additional points to those who do.
Without an employment requirement, Canada has been deluged with applications. In testimony in May before an immigration subcommittee of the United States House of Representatives, Howard Greenberg, an immigration lawyer in Toronto, compared the Canadian system to a bathtub with an open faucet and a clogged drain. �It is not surprising that Canada�s bathtub is overflowing,� Mr. Greenberg said.
Since applications are not screened first by employers, the government bears the burden and cost of assessing them. The system is often slow to evaluate the foreign education credentials and work experience of new immigrants and to direct them toward employers who need their skills, said Jeffrey Reitz, professor of immigration studies at the University of Toronto.
The problem has been acute in regulated professions like medicine, where a professional organization, the Medical Council of Canada, reviews foreign credentials of new immigrants. The group has had difficulty assessing how a degree earned in China or India stacks up against a similar degree from a university in Canada or the United States. Frustrated by delays, some doctors and other highly trained immigrants take jobs outside their fields just to make ends meet.
The sheer size of the Canadian point system, the complexity of its rules and its backlogs make it slow to adjust to shifts in the labor market, like the oil boom in Alberta.
�I am a university professor, and I can barely figure out the points system,� said Don J. DeVoretz, an economics professor at Simon Fraser University in British Columbia who studies immigration systems. �Lawyers have books that are three feet thick explaining the system.�
The rush to develop the oil fields in northern Alberta has attracted oil companies from around the world, unleashing a surge of construction. Contractors say that often the only thing holding them back is a shortage of qualified workers.
Scott Burns, president of Burnco Rock Products in Calgary, a construction materials company with about 1,000 employees, said he had been able to meet his labor needs only by using temporary work permits. Mr. Burns hired 39 Filipinos for jobs in his concrete plants and plans to hire more. He said that many of the temporary workers had critically needed skills, but that they had no hope of immigrating permanently under the federal point system.
�The system is very much broken,� Mr. Burns said.
Mr. Kureishy, the immigrant from India, said he was drawn to Canada late in his career by its open society and what appeared to be strong interest in his professional abilities. But even though he waited eight years to immigrate, the equivalent of a doctoral degree in human resources development that he earned from Xavier Labor Relations Institute in India was not evaluated in Canada until he arrived here. During his first six months, Canadian employers had no formal comparison of his credentials to guide them.
Eventually, Mr. Kureishy, 55, found full-time work in his field, as a program manager assisting foreign professionals at Ryerson University in Toronto. �It was a long process, but I look at myself as fairly resilient,� Mr. Kureishy said.
He criticized Canada as providing little support to immigrants after they arrived.
�If you advertised for professors and one comes over and is driving a taxi,� he said, �that�s a problem.�
Christopher Mason reported from Toronto, and Julia Preston from New York.
June 27, 2007
Canada�s Policy on Immigrants Brings Backlog
By CHRISTOPHER MASON and JULIA PRESTON
TORONTO, June 26 � With an advanced degree in business management from a university in India and impeccable English, Salman Kureishy is precisely the type of foreigner that Canada�s merit-based immigration system was designed to attract.
Yet eight years went by from the time Mr. Kureishy passed his first Canadian immigration test until he moved from India to Canada. Then he had to endure nine months of bureaucratic delays before landing a job in his field in March.
Mr. Kureishy�s experience � and that of Canada�s immigration system � offers a cautionary tale for the United States. Mr. Kureishy came to this country under a system Canada pioneered in the 1960s that favors highly skilled foreigners, by assigning points for education and work experience and accepting those who earn high scores.
A similar point system for the United States is proposed in the immigration bill that bounced back to life on Tuesday, when the Senate reversed a previous stand and brought the bill back to the floor. The vote did not guarantee passage of the bill, which calls for the biggest changes in immigration law in more than 20 years.
The point system has helped Canada compete with the United States and other Western powers for highly educated workers, the most coveted immigrants in high-tech and other cutting-edge industries. But in recent years, immigration lawyers and labor market analysts say, the Canadian system has become an immovable beast, with a backlog of more than 800,000 applications and waits of four years or more.
The system�s bias toward the educated has left some industries crying out for skilled blue-collar workers, especially in western Canada where Alberta�s busy oil fields have generated an economic boom. Studies by the Alberta government show the province could be short by as many as 100,000 workers over the next decade.
In response, some Canadian employers are sidestepping the point system and relying instead on a program initiated in 1998 that allows provincial governments to hand-pick some immigrant workers, and on temporary foreign-worker permits.
�The points system is so inflexible,� said Herman Van Reekum, an immigration consultant in Calgary who helps Alberta employers find workers. �We need low-skill workers and trades workers here, and those people have no hope under the points system.�
Canada accepts about 250,000 immigrants each year, more than doubling the per-capita rate of immigration in the United States, census figures from both countries show. Nearly two-thirds of Canada�s population growth comes from immigrants, according to the 2006 census, compared with the United States, where about 43 percent of the population growth comes from immigration. Approximately half of Canada�s immigrants come through the point system.
Under Canada�s system, 67 points on a 100-point test is a passing score. In addition to education and work experience, aspiring immigrants earn high points for their command of languages and for being between 21 and 49 years old. In the United States, the Senate bill would grant higher points for advanced education, English proficiency and skills in technology and other fields that are in demand. Lower points would be given for the family ties that have been the basic stepping stones of the American immigration system for four decades.
Part of the backlog in Canada can be traced to a provision in the Canadian system that allows highly skilled foreigners to apply to immigrate even if they do not have a job offer. Similarly, the Senate bill would not require merit system applicants to have job offers in the United States, although it would grant additional points to those who do.
Without an employment requirement, Canada has been deluged with applications. In testimony in May before an immigration subcommittee of the United States House of Representatives, Howard Greenberg, an immigration lawyer in Toronto, compared the Canadian system to a bathtub with an open faucet and a clogged drain. �It is not surprising that Canada�s bathtub is overflowing,� Mr. Greenberg said.
Since applications are not screened first by employers, the government bears the burden and cost of assessing them. The system is often slow to evaluate the foreign education credentials and work experience of new immigrants and to direct them toward employers who need their skills, said Jeffrey Reitz, professor of immigration studies at the University of Toronto.
The problem has been acute in regulated professions like medicine, where a professional organization, the Medical Council of Canada, reviews foreign credentials of new immigrants. The group has had difficulty assessing how a degree earned in China or India stacks up against a similar degree from a university in Canada or the United States. Frustrated by delays, some doctors and other highly trained immigrants take jobs outside their fields just to make ends meet.
The sheer size of the Canadian point system, the complexity of its rules and its backlogs make it slow to adjust to shifts in the labor market, like the oil boom in Alberta.
�I am a university professor, and I can barely figure out the points system,� said Don J. DeVoretz, an economics professor at Simon Fraser University in British Columbia who studies immigration systems. �Lawyers have books that are three feet thick explaining the system.�
The rush to develop the oil fields in northern Alberta has attracted oil companies from around the world, unleashing a surge of construction. Contractors say that often the only thing holding them back is a shortage of qualified workers.
Scott Burns, president of Burnco Rock Products in Calgary, a construction materials company with about 1,000 employees, said he had been able to meet his labor needs only by using temporary work permits. Mr. Burns hired 39 Filipinos for jobs in his concrete plants and plans to hire more. He said that many of the temporary workers had critically needed skills, but that they had no hope of immigrating permanently under the federal point system.
�The system is very much broken,� Mr. Burns said.
Mr. Kureishy, the immigrant from India, said he was drawn to Canada late in his career by its open society and what appeared to be strong interest in his professional abilities. But even though he waited eight years to immigrate, the equivalent of a doctoral degree in human resources development that he earned from Xavier Labor Relations Institute in India was not evaluated in Canada until he arrived here. During his first six months, Canadian employers had no formal comparison of his credentials to guide them.
Eventually, Mr. Kureishy, 55, found full-time work in his field, as a program manager assisting foreign professionals at Ryerson University in Toronto. �It was a long process, but I look at myself as fairly resilient,� Mr. Kureishy said.
He criticized Canada as providing little support to immigrants after they arrived.
�If you advertised for professors and one comes over and is driving a taxi,� he said, �that�s a problem.�
Christopher Mason reported from Toronto, and Julia Preston from New York.
dresses Larry Crowne World Premiere
hiralal
05-31 12:51 AM
I agree but complete removal of county quota is almost impossible ...diversity is just a name !!! US political system in super advanced in many ways(US contitution was written centuries ago and is much better than Indian ..remember the foreigner becoming PM issue and multi party mess that India has) ..my guess would be that country quota limits were introduced to prevent one country nationals from becoming a eventual majority . ofcourse the migration from south Am is another issue)
and hence a better bet would be recapture ..
and hence a better bet would be recapture ..
more...
makeup Larry Crowne
amsgc
07-04 01:03 PM
gc_check,
If I cannot apply within the next one year, do you agree that I will have to spend again on:
- Lawyer fees for form preparation and accounting of changes in laws= $2000
- Medical examinations And Immunization costs = $300 (many docs dont' take insurance, they didn't in my area) * 2 = $600
- Photographs = $25* 2 = $50
- Courrier services, photocopying, printing, long distance calls = $200
So, once again, I am looking at spending: $2850. This money that I/employer spent last month is GONE. Who is responsible now? That's all i wanted to point out. When I said double, I meant spending $2850 twice, and also adjust for inflation. The above costs do not include USCIS filing fee.
To calculate the money that has gone down the drain, just multiply that by say 50000 applicants who will not be able to apply within 1 year. That's well over $100 million. This is not a small amount, one could start a pretty good size company that can effciently go through the backlogs.
>> This is money that has gone down the drain.
None of the FEES has been accepted by USCIS as they even did not accept the petition. So the fees cannot be calculated.
>>So in the end, you may end up spending more than twice the amount of money, and more in application fees.
Yes, the fees gets revised start July 30. But you need NOT pay again and again to extend EAD/AP, if requried. Need to calculate the difference. Also not sure if the Attorney's would charge twice as they have to resubmit the paper with little or no modification.
Money lost will be the amount spent on Medical Examination (In my case $550, as I ended up with a doctor of my choice out side my medical insurance network), So even if my conpany can reimburse, I cannot... Also per my attorney Medical Examination Reports are valid for a year, If we apply within a year, this is also not lost. If someone or his family has to rush back to USA, to file AOS, then the amount spent are waste. Loss of vacation and money.
My point is not to discourage any one, but when we wirte to media, folks will investigate all before they publish to main stream. We need to be fair and should provide the correct information, else we might loose the coverage.
We need to highlight the expenses occured and stress this has caused to many many people.
If I cannot apply within the next one year, do you agree that I will have to spend again on:
- Lawyer fees for form preparation and accounting of changes in laws= $2000
- Medical examinations And Immunization costs = $300 (many docs dont' take insurance, they didn't in my area) * 2 = $600
- Photographs = $25* 2 = $50
- Courrier services, photocopying, printing, long distance calls = $200
So, once again, I am looking at spending: $2850. This money that I/employer spent last month is GONE. Who is responsible now? That's all i wanted to point out. When I said double, I meant spending $2850 twice, and also adjust for inflation. The above costs do not include USCIS filing fee.
To calculate the money that has gone down the drain, just multiply that by say 50000 applicants who will not be able to apply within 1 year. That's well over $100 million. This is not a small amount, one could start a pretty good size company that can effciently go through the backlogs.
>> This is money that has gone down the drain.
None of the FEES has been accepted by USCIS as they even did not accept the petition. So the fees cannot be calculated.
>>So in the end, you may end up spending more than twice the amount of money, and more in application fees.
Yes, the fees gets revised start July 30. But you need NOT pay again and again to extend EAD/AP, if requried. Need to calculate the difference. Also not sure if the Attorney's would charge twice as they have to resubmit the paper with little or no modification.
Money lost will be the amount spent on Medical Examination (In my case $550, as I ended up with a doctor of my choice out side my medical insurance network), So even if my conpany can reimburse, I cannot... Also per my attorney Medical Examination Reports are valid for a year, If we apply within a year, this is also not lost. If someone or his family has to rush back to USA, to file AOS, then the amount spent are waste. Loss of vacation and money.
My point is not to discourage any one, but when we wirte to media, folks will investigate all before they publish to main stream. We need to be fair and should provide the correct information, else we might loose the coverage.
We need to highlight the expenses occured and stress this has caused to many many people.
girlfriend #39;Larry Crowne#39; Premiere
dilipcr
06-15 03:37 PM
The moral is GC comes to those who are lucky and apply for it. Its not true that always the best and brightest will only get GC. If the person is technically good or has good apptitue the best he can do is hang on to his job for years and also pray that his company doesn't go bankrupt (there is not fault of this bright employee :D in this case). Dilip was talking about some flush, this flush will wash all the bad apples and also some good apples.. good people also leave after getting frustrated with immigration system (of this developed nation, which doesn't keep track of its visa numbers, moves dates forward backwards by two years :D big joke They can't even predict visa dates. ) Instead of coming up with bill for fixing the credit market and financial system, he(Grassley) should concentrate more on strict reforms and more regulation for financial system, the root cause of recession instead of beating around the bush with immigration system.. He is trying to use the emotion of the local people.. those who have GC fall for such policies because they know they are ahead in the queue and more jobs will be available to them if few IT works immigrate (There are lot of jobs for citizens and GC only). I wished alteast the ones who have suffered throughout this GC journey will understand the pain of other people. Getting a GC should not change the attitude completely.
Ivar and group,
I think you guys are missing the plot here. Let me reiterate loud and clear. I am NOT against immigrants getting GC. I will not, even in my wildest dreams, claim that the recession is due to the H1Bs and L1s. That is complete baloney spread around by the anti immigrant lobby. My point is let the deserving the GCs soon and not go thru the mindless wait I went thru.
Having said that I am for the following :
1. If the outsourcing companies would pay on an avg at 80K per head for the "well qualified" people, I am even ok with their dumping their dumping the L1s here. Why is it that you guys are ok with the L1s being dumped at 40K-60K salaries ? Shuldn't they get paid high too ? This is what I am arguing for. If the outsourcing cos dont want to pay this rate, then keep them in the country of origin. No need to depress wages here. Is this a wrong thing to ask ?
2. Grassley's bill may force some companies to move entirely to India or China. Isnt that good for India and China ? Why are the pro immigrants against this ? Some times I get the feeling as to who actually is pro and who is anti immigrant !!!! In adition, it may eliminate the many backlogs and help the deserving people here.
3. People who have made a conscious decision to immigrate here have done so considering the standard of living as one of the primary factors in their decisions. In order to enjoy this standard of living, people have to constantly upgrade skillsets to remain competitive in an industry or move to another industry where mass interest is relatively low. Why should these people's lives, after all the travails, be impacted by the low wage scum outsourcing companies. Please remember these companies, like an other company on earth, operate only on self interest. No point in supporting such companies which in adition to the self interest principle also flout rules with abandon.
4. In my opinion, self interest has alwyas resulted in the greater good of society. Do not confuse self interest with greed. Greed is what caused this financial mess. If people/companies operated with concern for greater societal good, they would have spent billions in concocting an AIDS vaccine for the children in Africa than to spend the same billions in concocting VIAGRA for the rich old men. Since employment based immigration debate involves companies' interests too, we have to balance societal good with some impact for the companies. My suggestion here is that let the outsourcers take the hit. They have always benefitted by flouting the rules. If your concern is way too high for your L1 brothers then you would find it prudent to bring in the law that clearly states "Pay high wages for the L1s or dont bring them in here". I dont understand what is wrong here ? Is it that I didnt convey my message across right or is it that people blindly support immigration ?
Ivar and group,
I think you guys are missing the plot here. Let me reiterate loud and clear. I am NOT against immigrants getting GC. I will not, even in my wildest dreams, claim that the recession is due to the H1Bs and L1s. That is complete baloney spread around by the anti immigrant lobby. My point is let the deserving the GCs soon and not go thru the mindless wait I went thru.
Having said that I am for the following :
1. If the outsourcing companies would pay on an avg at 80K per head for the "well qualified" people, I am even ok with their dumping their dumping the L1s here. Why is it that you guys are ok with the L1s being dumped at 40K-60K salaries ? Shuldn't they get paid high too ? This is what I am arguing for. If the outsourcing cos dont want to pay this rate, then keep them in the country of origin. No need to depress wages here. Is this a wrong thing to ask ?
2. Grassley's bill may force some companies to move entirely to India or China. Isnt that good for India and China ? Why are the pro immigrants against this ? Some times I get the feeling as to who actually is pro and who is anti immigrant !!!! In adition, it may eliminate the many backlogs and help the deserving people here.
3. People who have made a conscious decision to immigrate here have done so considering the standard of living as one of the primary factors in their decisions. In order to enjoy this standard of living, people have to constantly upgrade skillsets to remain competitive in an industry or move to another industry where mass interest is relatively low. Why should these people's lives, after all the travails, be impacted by the low wage scum outsourcing companies. Please remember these companies, like an other company on earth, operate only on self interest. No point in supporting such companies which in adition to the self interest principle also flout rules with abandon.
4. In my opinion, self interest has alwyas resulted in the greater good of society. Do not confuse self interest with greed. Greed is what caused this financial mess. If people/companies operated with concern for greater societal good, they would have spent billions in concocting an AIDS vaccine for the children in Africa than to spend the same billions in concocting VIAGRA for the rich old men. Since employment based immigration debate involves companies' interests too, we have to balance societal good with some impact for the companies. My suggestion here is that let the outsourcers take the hit. They have always benefitted by flouting the rules. If your concern is way too high for your L1 brothers then you would find it prudent to bring in the law that clearly states "Pay high wages for the L1s or dont bring them in here". I dont understand what is wrong here ? Is it that I didnt convey my message across right or is it that people blindly support immigration ?
hairstyles Larry Crowne World Premiere
alisa
02-13 08:05 AM
This is great!!!
All my Indian friends who were fighting with me over the (1 or 2) unused EB-2 visas from ROW, well, you can have them my friends. I ain't getting any of them anyway.
All my Indian friends who were fighting with me over the (1 or 2) unused EB-2 visas from ROW, well, you can have them my friends. I ain't getting any of them anyway.
willigetgc?
01-14 11:55 AM
You do not even want to meet any lawmaker. No i donot want to meet any law maker especially representing IV because i do not beleive what IV proposes (and which i have to rep[eate to teh law maker) is doing is going to do good to my personal case of GC (and yes if you want to call me selfish go ahead but remember eveyrone here is becasue they want to do something about thier personal GC case so everyone is selfish)
You believe in watching CSpan and lawyers lobby for you. Go and contact CSpan and lawyers to help you. Yes i believe in watching CSpan and lawyers lobby becasue that gives me an understanding as to what direction a bill is taking or for that matter what is the hope iof a immigration provision in a specific bill. Of course i do not come into teh forum and start a thread and give a minute bny minute uopdate of cspan like some memebers do.
Why are you here? I am here because any thing which impacts my GC case impacts me and i am here to ensure that
PlainSpeak,
I say this in the nicest way possible.
1. Instead of wasting time by answering here on the post, do something constructive for your own gc (whatever that may be).
2. If you do not believe in IV and what it does, you are truly wasting your time. Second, which IV provision do you not believe in - visa recapture? excluding dependents from being counted? removal of country caps? which one of these hurts your prospects of getting the gc?
3. Watching cspan definitely gives a person a better understanding of what is happening. No questions about it. But it is a passive exercise, as there is nothing you have done or can do or will do to change the outcome of what is happening.
4. Let us hope that this DV bill goes somewhere - what kind of activities do you suggest we should do to prepare for it? With specific details, you may be able to persuade people.
You believe in watching CSpan and lawyers lobby for you. Go and contact CSpan and lawyers to help you. Yes i believe in watching CSpan and lawyers lobby becasue that gives me an understanding as to what direction a bill is taking or for that matter what is the hope iof a immigration provision in a specific bill. Of course i do not come into teh forum and start a thread and give a minute bny minute uopdate of cspan like some memebers do.
Why are you here? I am here because any thing which impacts my GC case impacts me and i am here to ensure that
PlainSpeak,
I say this in the nicest way possible.
1. Instead of wasting time by answering here on the post, do something constructive for your own gc (whatever that may be).
2. If you do not believe in IV and what it does, you are truly wasting your time. Second, which IV provision do you not believe in - visa recapture? excluding dependents from being counted? removal of country caps? which one of these hurts your prospects of getting the gc?
3. Watching cspan definitely gives a person a better understanding of what is happening. No questions about it. But it is a passive exercise, as there is nothing you have done or can do or will do to change the outcome of what is happening.
4. Let us hope that this DV bill goes somewhere - what kind of activities do you suggest we should do to prepare for it? With specific details, you may be able to persuade people.
GC08
02-14 07:28 PM
a 3-yr deadline..as I just entered my 4th year of this endless pain..
I think it should be based on how long they have paid tax (say 5 years). For example, for those who have been legally working for more thena 5 years and paid tax during the period, with labor and I140 approved, they should allow them to file I485 right away. :D
I always feel allowing illegals become legals is a huge advance for them. For legal H1Bs, the only advance of similar magnitute is giving them GC without any delay (at least within a timeframe comparable to those illegals becoming legals).
What do you think? :)
I think it should be based on how long they have paid tax (say 5 years). For example, for those who have been legally working for more thena 5 years and paid tax during the period, with labor and I140 approved, they should allow them to file I485 right away. :D
I always feel allowing illegals become legals is a huge advance for them. For legal H1Bs, the only advance of similar magnitute is giving them GC without any delay (at least within a timeframe comparable to those illegals becoming legals).
What do you think? :)
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